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[ Suggestions ] The ranked battle protection abuse

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  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2017-10-06 09:22:14Show this Author OnlyDescending Order
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Currently, one of the player is abusing the fact that when a player is challenged in ranked battle, no one else can challenge that player.

Specifically, for the past few days, he gets to 1st place 3-5 min before reward time, then have someone else challenge him so that he cannot be challenged by me and one of my group mate, who have the capability of knocking him off.

I'm not mentioning him by name because there is, frankly, no way for me to prove that this is what is happening. Thou quite frankly, now that ranked battle can resolve in 30s, it's unnatural for someone to be "tagged" for an entire 3-5 min near the end (and he doesn't lose as a result)


Instead, here is a few potential changes to counteract this. Note that any ONE of those would work, I'm merely providing options.

Note, the top ones are the easiest, the latter ones are harder. Thou there are other considerations. For example, #1 is super easy, but I don't expect it to happen.


1. Move pain in ranked shop to survival shop. The only reason we care, and he does this, is because now there is something useful in ranked shop. This change would effectively destroy the motivation.


2 Change reward structure so top 3 get same reward. This makes grabbing any top 3 spot equally good. And quite frankly, while one slot can be "tagged" by this mechanic, it's far more unlikely for all 3 to be tied down. So even if someone use this trick to guarantee their own rewards, at least other players have something to fight for.


3. Randomized reward time. This "camp at last second then challenge" thing is bad in and of itself. Even without this protection thing, the last second sniping isn't exactly healthy in and of itself. The same applies to space timed ranking as well. If, however, the reward time is random within a set window of 30-60 minutes, this would be far more unlikely.


4. Multiple reward batches. Specifically, instead of giving all reward at one time during the day. Make it give out 10 or 20% of the reward 10 or 5 times throughout the day, every (other) hour. Due to limited ranked battle attempts, it's rather unlikely for people to be able to "cheat" during all reward periods. This is, in a way, like qualifying for space time final, measuring consistent ranking as opposed to a single instance. Note that all rewards are divisible by 5 with most divisible by 10, so implementation can be made without changing reward at all or with only minimal change.


5. Must-skip within the last 10 min before reward time: right now, skip is an option. And the only way for this "tagging" to work is if the battle is not skipped, as otherwise the "protection" ends in 20-30 seconds. So if all battle automatically skip when it's close to reward time, protection won't be a thing. Snipping thou, still would.


6. Change it so that multiple player can challenge the same person. If this happens, if any of the challenger win, all the current on-going battles will be terminated. The attempt chance may or may not be refunded (this is up to you, so kind of 6a and 6b).


7. Make it so only #2 can challenge #1, only #3 can challenge #2 and only #4 can challenge #3. If a player who is previously ranked 2-4 who is currently challenging for higher position is challenged and lost(thus no longer have the position with the "right" to the current challenge), the fight is terminated, the attempt may or may not be refunded.
First, fact of the matter is that this is only a game design problem on the very high ranking. Because for anyone else, there are plenty of other options. So this change is mostly focused on the top ranking. With this new structure, a single "helper" will not be able to help #1 secure their spot. Because if the "helper" is in slot #2, #3 could knock him off, terminating the fight THEN go for #1. And if the helper is not in #2, whoever is in #2 can go after him. So for #1 to secure his spot with helpers, he'd have to control #2,3,4 and someone else to tag #4, this is rather unlikely. This would also solve the problem of someone who is highly ranked (top 3) being randomly knocked out of top 10 in the last few minutes, which have happened before. While still possible, it would take a series of losses which is far more unlikely considering that such a highly ranked individual is likely strong.


Yes, 7 still qualifies as "few". It does... right?


And for the record, yes, I am salty. To be quite honest, it doesn't impact me too much as I have trouble beating him, I'm ftp he is ptw, I only have 20-30% chance of beating him. But the fact that dirty trick is being used really irks me.





This post was last edited by Tobei on 2017-10-06 09:22:14.
  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2017-09-11 16:25:11Show this Author Only
2#

most of the p2winners * lol.. and abuse the system they pay for.

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On 2017-10-05 11:58:13Show this Author Only
3#

Bump no jutsu, this is still being done.

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On 2017-10-06 02:35:45Show this Author Only
4#

you know, u can do the same, tell a friend to attack u in spacetime at the 10min mark to stop them from grabbing it

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On 2017-10-06 03:43:08Show this Author Only
5#
  • Shadoblaze On 2017-10-06 02:35:45
  • you know, u can do the same, tell a friend to attack u in spacetime at the 10min mark to stop them from grabbing it

Whether he does it or not, it's a shady gaming tactic like in other games that have a ranking system that rewards based on your rank.

  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2017-10-06 04:04:12Show this Author Only
6#
  • Shadoblaze On 2017-10-06 02:35:45
  • you know, u can do the same, tell a friend to attack u in spacetime at the 10min mark to stop them from grabbing it

The "join them" concept is a complete failure in logic.

I mean why would any game ever bother with balancing when everyone can just play whatever is broken?

I mean why would there be laws at all, when everyone can do the same would-be-illegal activity that anyone else does?


I've only ever seen people use this argument when they can't come up with any actual defense for a practice, so they argue for the anarchical alternative just for argument's sake or in hope of being able to continuously exploit the problem. Which one are you?


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On 2017-10-06 04:55:41Show this Author Only
7#
  • PraiseLuka On 2017-10-06 04:04:12
  • The "join them" concept is a complete failure in logic.

    I mean why would any game ever bother with balancing when everyone can just play whatever is broken?

    I mean why would there be laws at all, when everyone can do the same would-be-illegal activity that anyone else does?


    I've only ever seen people use this argument when they can't come up with any actual defense for a practice, so they argue for the anarchical alternative just for argument's sake or in hope of being able to continuously exploit the problem. Which one are you?


im the one who said its not illegal or broken so why does it need to be changed? just because u dont like it its wrong? come on now, be sensible. its a feature of the game, dont complain just because its a feature that doesnt work in your favor.

People have also done the same to me too, so its not like i started this, i just decided it wasnt going to change(cause u can do the same stuff in cn still).

i do attack people at the last minute because they do the same to me, and i want the rewards just like they do, i dont get people to attack me and make me unattackable though, mostly just because people arent online when rewards get sent out since all the events have finished

Others have made teams that beat me with luck or if they had the exact right positions and would swap their team just to keep beating me and then i would beat them back, so i have gotten sick of the back and forth and dont want to deal with it when they attack me 3 times in a row to get lucky enough to win and then i need to attack once to take my spot back and 2 people are doing that it gets annoying and i would rather just wait for the reward timer to take my spot get my rewards and let the other people keep the title during the day.


TLDR: dealing with fights the whole day is too annoying, so i would rather spend 2minutes to get my rewards at the last minute, if you dont like people wanting to not spend all day on a back and forth then dont participate and let them keep the spot.


  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2017-10-06 06:13:42Show this Author Only
8#

"just because u dont like it its wrong?" No, but neither does the fact that you say "its not illegal or broken" make it right.


objectively speaking, ranked battle should be about "strength". Not necessarily raw power mind you, but a combination of all factors, including team building/countering and as it were, luck. This trick cir*vent it, thus is against the design purpose of the feature. This is why i assert that this is an abuse, as it goes against the intended design of a feature. It's not a matter of opinion.


Last minute sniping is a lesser problem, as long as back-and-forth based on "strength' is still happens it's not a problem. Ideally the battle should take 0 time so that people would not end up being 1st ranked purely because they happen to, by chance of luck, be the last one to finish their battle before the end. Still, unlike the protection abuse, this practice still relies on "strength" and therefore is not against the intended design of the feature, that's what makes it relative ok.


"dont complain just because its a feature that doesnt work in your favor" Your premise is wrong. Because as it were, my win rate against him is low. This means if we were both to employ such a tactic, I would be the one gaining a bigger benefit, as then the win rate hardly matters, it's a only a matter of who happen to be able to grab the spot and then initiate protection until the end.


  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2017-10-06 09:21:37Show this Author Only
9#

There's simply nothing we can do about this.Protection was in place to avoid confusion in the rankings. It'll most likely remain intact.


I'll be changing the topic to [Suggestions], as this reflects what you've proposed towards fixing said issue.

  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2017-10-06 11:48:55Show this Author Only
10#

I like no. 2. option

My friends and I are 3rd, 4th, and me 5th respectively. I can be 3rd place if I change my teams to beat him specifically.

Anyway. 1st, 2nd and 3rd are pretty much equally power they should have given them equal coins. I think that's the best solution.

My friends and I used to beat each other on the last min before they gave out coins, now we don't really care. Too much effort.


Option 7 is also nice, BUT Rank 1 won't be able to do his Monthly Event then if that comes back. Or is it there still next week? I have not yet looked at.

  • Registered: 2017-07-24
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On 2017-10-06 11:54:54Show this Author Only
11#
  • Broken Screen On 2017-10-06 11:48:55
  • I like no. 2. option

    My friends and I are 3rd, 4th, and me 5th respectively. I can be 3rd place if I change my teams to beat him specifically.

    Anyway. 1st, 2nd and 3rd are pretty much equally power they should have given them equal coins. I think that's the best solution.

    My friends and I used to beat each other on the last min before they gave out coins, now we don't really care. Too much effort.


    Option 7 is also nice, BUT Rank 1 won't be able to do his Monthly Event then if that comes back. Or is it there still next week? I have not yet looked at.

It is next week, thou #7 ranked 1st can still hit ranked 5th and 6th. For that matter, ranked 2-4 can hit people behind them as well, it's just that they cannot jump when doing forward hits.

As it were, they can change who they see as well, since #3, for example, can't hit #1, he could just see #2, #5-8, instead of #1,2, 4-6 like now--only seeing valid targets.

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On 2017-10-09 03:19:31Show this Author Only
12#

Since I'm weak, I don't understand anything but 'Move Pain to Survival Shop' but I gotta say I'm a fan of that idea.


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On 2017-10-22 19:43:16Show this Author Only
13#

Wow you wrote an essay about something so insignificant?

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